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This group is about DeFiChain - a project that is bringing DeFi to the Bitcoin ecosystem! For more info: https://defichain.com
That is wrong, I wrote that it is exactly the same as Bitcoin and with the 20k you just get permission to participate. You also need a miner that is limited in the hashrate. The rest is exactly like Bitcoin - if you know your way around there, you can transfer all the consensus issues directly.
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Yes. Risks are good. Investing is ok for me, interest is not. Thats all
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I started on your side but you elegantly argued against it.
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Btc requires an investment in machines. If the price goes down and your investment cost more than the rewards you lose, the opposite you gain. Thats investing. Nothing to do with interest
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BTC does the same, the secret is just harder to solve because many are trying. It does absolutely nothing to change the fact that the blockchain creates coins out of thin air and distributes them in the form of inflation.
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Sorry, the statement makes no sense.
Bake provides you with offers and interest is earned on them. the same as if you lend something to your neighbor and he gives it back to you after a few weeks with interest. If that is not for you, then bake is not for you.
But fortunately the group here is not about bake but about defichain.
Btc doesnt. Thats the whole point here. Mining whether through staking or machines isnt thin air
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In case of pow, the miners keep the network secure because the whole system is checked all the time by everyone hence its seemless, censorship resistant and permissionless. At the same time actual work is being done to solve the puzzle that creates new blocks and are being rewarded for finding those blocks, this is all the time verified and kept in place by all the miners. Fees are something completelty different because here your talking about transactions and those depend on other paratmeters.
POS is the same thing but instead of physical machines, the coins are delegated within a pool thst secures and finds new blocks, same principle different approach. In both cases the rewards for finding new blocks is through a process that requires resources, nothing from thin air.
Im not even a programmer or.coder and get this.
Lets just stop it cause whether your right or im right, it doesnt add value to anything were trying to achieve.
Just some numbers and algorithm is exactly what all of crypto is. Its not physical but theres a huge difference between thin air and the actual work thats being done. Again, if its not an axe and your hands doing work doesnt mean its thin air. The machine im talking about with POW is a miner. I guess thats a physical as it gets in crypto.
Of course supply can be altered in the case of max supply. Thats not the same as a coin being minted and blocks being created through a process of POS or POW where its actually helping to secure the network.
Eitherway we have different ways of viewing this so pointless to discuss this further.
Completely disagree with your thin air statement. If your staking cardano for example, your coins are keeping the network secure and minting new blocks , in other words working. Just cause your nkt there with an axe doesnt mean its created out of thin air. Same applies for POW but there theres no coins doing the work but its a machine. If DFI network doesnt have a protocol in the code that coins are actually securing the network or computing to solve computations then indeed its just a bank where u deposit coins and u create new ones out of thin air. This is not the case for Cardano, Ada and eth.
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As I said, both PoS and PoW have Servers doing work. Different work. In PoS, the coins do nothing. They are the buy-in for a masternode and the guarantee that a masternode will support the network. In the end, in both PoW and PoS, the blockrewards are created out of thin air.
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Where do you think the block rewards come from in Bitcoin?
Bitcoin works on proof-of-work, miners think and receive new block rewards for finding a block. DeFiChain works according to proof-of-stake. Miners here secure the network not by energy, but by their effort. When a masternode finds a new block, it receives blockrewards as a reward. In both cases, new coins are created out of thin air. That's not bad or evil either, but that's how it works. Both consensus mechanisms have their advantages and disadvantages.
What do you want to do specifically? If you want to interact with the DeFichain DEX, then you need a DeFichain wallet to have a DeFichain address in order to deposit.
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No need to argue this further. You explained it well
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Liquiditymining is nothing special that runs on the defichain. pancakeswap sushiswap uniswap. all are based on the same principles. And sure, there are risks and opportunities in all of it. What is important is that if you provide liquidity, you get your share of the swap fees in return - but that is also identical for all the DEXes.
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You made it very clear that DFI doesnt require machines, only a deposit of 20k and nothing else.
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I tried to argue the case that what your doing with LM is actually not that but an investment and something where theres a risk and both parties can win or lose
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Exactly. Im avoiding that. Interest
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Now whether your right or im right. How are we benefitting from this. Personally ive decided not to do anything with bake.io anymore cause i find interest and creating something out of thin air unethical
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it is pretty simple: if btc creates out of thin air, then defichain does. If not, then not 😎
If you want to understand the process at Defichain there are many here that can help you.
If its all the same then the process to mine would be the same (POW) but its not. The mystery isnt solved th same way. Not sure how u guys changed the parameters for mining exactly but if what your saying is the only thing, you deposit 20k and then you create new coins, thats exactly what a bank does and its pure interest. Im leaning in this case to be like highlander, there can only be one. Yours would be thin air, BTC certainly is not.
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just to understand: Bitcoin and Defichain have the same consensus algorithm. All the nodes and block verifications work exactly the same. The only difference in block generation is that you have to deposit 20k to be allowed to create blocks and that the hashrate is limited. The secret must be solved for both coins by the miners to finally be allowed to create the block.
This means either both generate from thin air or neither.
How is keeping the network secure? Coins or Masternodes? Where are new blockrewards coming from? As described, the work is done by the masternodes. With PoW, energy is consumed and miners compete to find the next block. With PoS, you buy a masternode with coins or participate safely in the consensus via a central staking provider/delegated PoS, as with Cardano. Nonetheless, unlike fees, blockrewards are created out of thin air. They are not there beforehand.
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What @Kassius84 is trying to say is that all crypto is created digitally. It’s not a physical resource. When you say ‘work’ ‘machine’ what exactly are all these work that happens? When you ‘mine’ a coin in a blockchain, it’s just some numbers and algorithm. Thus, ‘thin air’.
A coin or token is digital and therefore made out of thin air. Every blockchain has a set of rules that determine how many coins can be mined, but it’s just data, it’s just a parameter.
DefiChain DFI has. 1.2B max supply. But while this was determined at a start, who says it can’t be 1.3? Or 1.6? If you create a proposal and is approved by the Masternodes, then even this can be altered. Thus, out of ‘thin air’.
Maybe it could help to read some historical DFIPs and the whitepaper as the emmision rewards also for LM (crypto LM and later the dToken LM) and the distribution evolved due to requested DFIPs and masternode votings. LM earnings are block emmisions you are asking + commission feees. The DFIPS. https://github.com/DeFiCh/dfips/issues/18 or https://github.com/DeFiCh/dfips/issues/50 ar just two examples.
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No idea why your bringing up evil or bad. POW is doing something, POS is doing something. No thin air at all like you say. In case of POW, a machine is literally doing the work and you get rewarded. In POS, your coins do the work and your being rewarded. No such thing as thin air
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